GPA & CFA

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chuckist

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Hi,
If you want to be a CPA auditor, you need a B average to get in grad school(broadly). This is the minimum requirement for a school to believe that the student has the potential to become a CPA auditor. And still then, many won`t be able to finish and pass the exams.
For those who know people who became CFA charterholder / are charterholders. What, in your honest opinion, do you think are the minimum GPA that that a reasonably motivated fina/acco student needs to have in undergrad to believe that he has the ability to complete the 3 levels of the CFA (regardless of how many attemps he takes at it)?
Thanks for the inputs!
 
Ummm…I don’t know if I necessarily agree with the points that are inherent in the question. It’s not about GPA, it’s more about IQ and study habits. I, for one, had an atrocious GPA. But that’s because I was young and wanted to party, drink, and chase tail.
Later in life, I settled down, went back to school, and have since finished both exams.
 
Greenman72 wrote:
Ummm…I don’t know if I necessarily agree with the points that are inherent in the question. It’s not about GPA, it’s more about IQ and study habits. I, for one, had an atrocious GPA. But that’s because I was young and wanted to party, drink, and chase tail.
Later in life, I settled down, went back to school, and have since finished both exams.
Click to expand...
Agreed 100%. I had a sub 3.0 GPA, took 0 finance classes, 1 accounting class in school and still managed to get one of the best subject breakdowns my co-workers have ever seen, on all 3 levels, on the first go.
“This ain’t no tall order, this is nothing to me. Difficult takes a day, impossible takes a week” - Jay-Z
Just gotta sit down and grind it out.
 
Greenman72 wrote:
Ummm…I don’t know if I necessarily agree with the points that are inherent in the question. It’s not about GPA, it’s more about IQ and study habits. I, for one, had an atrocious GPA. But that’s because I was young and wanted to party, drink, and chase tail.
Later in life, I settled down, went back to school, and have since finished both exams.
Click to expand...
My question says “that a reasonably motivated fina/acco student”. It was meant to exclude people who didnt care because yes, then using GPA as an indicator of future performance is completely useless.
For the IQ its a good idea but I cant apply it unless somone in here is interested in measuring it!
 
hpracing007 wrote:
Greenman72 wrote:
Ummm…I don’t know if I necessarily agree with the points that are inherent in the question. It’s not about GPA, it’s more about IQ and study habits. I, for one, had an atrocious GPA. But that’s because I was young and wanted to party, drink, and chase tail.
Later in life, I settled down, went back to school, and have since finished both exams.
Click to expand...
Agreed 100%. I had a sub 3.0 GPA, took 0 finance classes, 1 accounting class in school and still managed to get one of the best subject breakdowns my co-workers have ever seen, on all 3 levels, on the first go.
“This ain’t no tall order, this is nothing to me. Difficult takes a day, impossible takes a week” - Jay-Z
Just gotta sit down and grind it out.
Click to expand...
Thanks for sharing! Good to know it worked for you!
 
I’m confused as to what you’re really asking here.
CPA =/= CFA. A lot of people who have a CPA get their CFA, but I don’t know how many CFA chartholders actually have a CPA designation.
Secondly, I don’t think you have to go to grad school to get your CPA (or CFA). If you pass the society exams and have taken undergrad courses in accounting, that’s probably enough. It may vary from country to country; I dunno. (Taking graduate-level courses, as part of a degree program or not, is entirely different).
And yes, CPA with a specialty in taxes / forensic accounting / auditing exams are probably hard because tax legislation and rules are complicated. However I don’t think there is any correlation between your undergrad GPA and your ability to pass the CPA or CFA stuff. A lot of people with high GPAs have a loose grasp of the material and are just really clever at gaming the system and hustling to get the answers and memorize them (or cheat).
You particular chance of passing the CFA and/or CPA exams has everything to do with your drive and self-discipline to learn the material. The exam graders don’t give a crap how you did in your undergrad courses.
 
kurtosis wrote:
I’m confused as to what you’re really asking here.
CPA =/= CFA. A lot of people who have a CPA get their CFA, but I don’t know how many CFA chartholders actually have a CPA designation.
Secondly, I don’t think you have to go to grad school to get your CPA (or CFA). If you pass the society exams and have taken undergrad courses in accounting, that’s probably enough. It may vary from country to country; I dunno. (Taking graduate-level courses, as part of a degree program or not, is entirely different).
And yes, CPA with a specialty in taxes / forensic accounting / auditing exams are probably hard because tax legislation and rules are complicated. However I don’t think there is any correlation between your undergrad GPA and your ability to pass the CPA or CFA stuff. A lot of people with high GPAs have a loose grasp of the material and are just really clever at gaming the system and hustling to get the answers and memorize them (or cheat).
You particular chance of passing the CFA and/or CPA exams has everything to do with your drive and self-discipline to learn the material. The exam graders don’t give a crap how you did in your undergrad courses.
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Okay, I’ll rephrase my question!
IIf you had one piece of information to bet on a person’s likelyness to complete is CFA: undergrad GPA.
What would it be ( C-, B, A-?)? But most importantly why?
 
I do not think there is any correlation between undergrad GPA and completion of CFA. I don’t think knowing their GPA would help me make a more informed bet if a person would complete the CFA program.
A high GPA can mean a lot of things:
- you went to an easy school that gave everybody As and Bs
- you took easy courses to ensure that you have a high GPA to boast about
- you cheated or otherwise gamed the system to ensure you had a high grade.
- you actually did study hard and understand the material well
The problem is that the vast majority of undergrad courses only test a student’s ability to solve a problem they have already seen solved in class or in the textbook. This is generally not what the CFA exams questions are done once you move past Level I.
 
I understand your point but I don’t think you answer the question. Unless you mean that you would do a coinflip when asked to bet on someone with a 4GPA vs a 2GPA on who, based on that info solely, has most chance.
By making such a statement you’re also saying that CPA / MBA / all other type of designation has no way to measure performance out of GPA. Then why do they all ask for minimum. CFA is one of the few who does not. But it does not mean that passing the exam is that different from all the other ones.
You’re also saying that any employer that have GPA cutoff has no way to measure someone’s chance of success then why does high finance seems to care so much?
I’m not saying that its a perfect science, but it does matter on average.
Anybody else?
 
A professional designation IS diferent than a graduate program.
The requirements for grad school require high GPA because the school wants to boast about its accomplished and elite student body to potential donors. The CFA society “ranks” its members on how well thy manage client portfolios and how much money they made for them. They have no reason to care about undergrad grades because the whole point is to market CFA chartholders as bein superior money managers to those who don’t have the CFA charter.
My point is that you’re mixing up professional designations and graduate programs as if they were the same thing, and tested the students ability in the same way. I think you’re focusing too much on numbers to gleam something from them which they don’t actually measure. Studying and doing well in grad school is nothing like studying and doing well in the CFA.
If you want to believe that somebody with an A+ GPA from some joke school like the University of Phoenix is “better” than somebody with a C+ average from the University of Chicago, go right ahead. My bet is that the Chicago kid is smarter and has a greater chance of passing the CFA exams. If I’m going to broadly generalize on someone’s chances of success, I choose to discriminate on school attended rather than GPA.
This is not to say that you shouldn’t study and try to do your best to get high scores in your university courses. You absolutely should. But in the event that you do get a great GPA don’t bullshit yourself into thinking that you’re smart and therefore can breeze through CFA exams, CPA exams, actuarial exams or whatever.
 
Thanks for your answer, its very insightful!
Anybody else?
 
GPA of 2.0, true motivation and a brain. A high school student could understand 70% of L1 curriculum and score reasonably well if tested on a single chapter at a time. It’s just a lot of grinding because there is so much material.
 
Latheorie wrote:
GPA of 2.0, true motivation and a brain. A high school student could understand 70% of L1 curriculum and score reasonably well if tested on a single chapter at a time. It’s just a lot of grinding because there is so much material.
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I don’t think you’re saying that’s there’s no correlation, because I feel there is, and a strong one at that, but obviously not 100%.
The combination of skills required to obtain a high GPA and pass the CFA exams are somewhat similar - a reasonably high aptitude to digest subject matter, and the work effort to see it through. Of course there are reasons someone may have a low GPA and still pass the CFA exams (or vice versa), but in general you’ll find that the typical CFA charterholder/candidate also performed relatively well academically.
 
The question was asking for a minimum so I gave my opinion of a minimum. Now there’s correlation here and there, that’s right. You are right saying that the typical CFA charterholder also performed relatively well academically, and that might be true for the succeeding candidate.In the 25% of no-shows every years, I wonder how many of those had good GPA.
 
I think that it comes to sitting down and studying more than anything. I don’t judge my intelligence by my GPA though.
 
chuckist wrote:
. What, in your honest opinion, do you think are the minimum GPA that that a reasonably motivated fina/acco student needs to have in undergrad to believe that he has the ability to complete the 3 levels of the CFA (regardless of how many attemps he takes at it)?
Click to expand...
As stated by other before me, I don’t think GPA correlates to success on the CFA exam. As such, I think your question is a bogus question and can’t be answered.
 
Agreed, there is no correlation to GPA and success on the CFA exams. Also, I would argue that there is little correlation to GPA and IQ. I graduated with a sub 3.0 gpa from undergrad from a private jesuit university and passed all three CFA exams on the first shot. It was my choice in undergrad to chase tail, booze and have a good time at the expense of my grades. I wouldn’t change that decision either. I finished my MSF with a 3.95 and smoked everyone in the program. People who get all snobby about undergrad GPA irritate me becuase they think it is a reflection of intelligence when infact it is not. I was smarter to get laid quite frequently.
 
It is not the GPA, but dedication which defines if you can get the CFA charter or not. According to me everyone who has the dedication, and right direction can get the CFA charter
 
Undergraduate classes are a joke at most schools. Yeah, you can load up on the “easy” finance courses and breeze through with a 4.0. Or you could take the super challenging bitch of a class where the class average is a C. GPA cut-offs are a joke because you’re judging someone on how successful they were when they were 19-20 years old. If you’re 26 and applying to a job and get cut, even though you’ve passed a few levels of CFA, that is bogus. Becoming a balanced person should be more important, especially doing a lot of extra-curriculars, networking, making friends. Judging someone on the basis of GPA is such a one-dimensional way to put someone into a “box”. It’s my belief that success in business is all about relationships. So you have the kid who got a 4.0 but can’t communicate, or a guy/girl with a 3.4 GPA who can carry on an intelligent conversation. Who is really smarter than the other? That cannot be answered. And it also cannot be answered who will do better on CFA. The ability to memorize and regurgitate material won’t get you past level 1, although this strategy can help you get high grades in undergrad.
 
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