MBA Myth

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Gouman

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I’ve been doing research on MBA programs. I’ve found quite a few programs whose curriculum’s are solid, and have fairly decent rankings. Since I’m from CA, I’ve naturally been looking at some of the UC’s (e.g. Irvine, Davis, Los Angeles), and a few CA private schools including USC, Loyola, Pepperdine, even University of San Francisco (USF).
I’m not too interested in schools out of state, but have looked at Vanderbilt, Bentley, UT- Austin, Rice, Ohio State, Babson, Emory.
All of these programs are good, but none are top 5-10 except maybe UCLA. Which brings me to the genesis of this thread.
There is a myth, a rumor, an urban legend among people trying to break into “high finance” front office role that an MBA from a less than top 5 program is useless, and a complete waste of time in terms of aiding one in breaking into their respective careers. This rumor is persistent and comes in different flavors (maybe top 5-10 as opposed to strictly top 5). However, I inquired directly and never had it confirmed by any recruiters, or people on the “inside” in these roles.
Of course, they could be lying to me, but I tend to think these are honest folks.
Without a doubt, I’m well aware that the higher the ranking and better the brand name of your degrees the better your prospects. This is confirmed by virtually everybody as fact, and I would never dispute it.
My concern is the worthlessness of any programs below the golden threshold of top 3, 5, or 10.
I find it hard to believe I would be no better off in my endeavors if I had an MBA from USC (which averages 30-40 on most surveys), Pepperdine (usually 40-50) or even Loyola and USF which are not ranked on any of the surveys I’ve seen. Particularly if I’m not target bulge bracket firms, but still competitive firms such as “B of A” Securities, Stifel, Jefferies, Piper, or Houlihan.
Nevertheless, this is exactly the presumption of many. Though I find it hard to believe, before I consider shelling out 30k a year to go to USC, plus the eye popping amount of interest that I will accrue for years after I’ve completed the degree, I’d like to know if the top 5-10 MBA myth really holds any water. Moreover, I’d like a little assurance I will be a significantly more competitive candidate.
As many AF poster are planning on going to grad school and realistically only a small fraction will go to a top 5 school, I imagine similar thoughts to have crossed other peoples minds. So please, feel free to give your two cents.
 
Actually, one of my best friends graduated from Seton Hall’s b-school and was advised by several headhunters and HR personnel to leave it off his resume. He was trying to land a Wall Street job though, I’m sure in other fields it is acceptable to graduate from a similarly-ranked school.
 
UT is good the rest are so-so. MBA programs are what you make of them.
 
I am looking at similar schools - Vanderbilt, UT-Austin, UNC, USC, Georgetown, and Emory. The whole thing is you should do what you need to do to improve your resume. For me, I went to an undergrad program ranked in the 45-55 range, so these programs I think will help me. Also, I am not looking for a hardcore Wall Street job. You may not get hired at Goldman Sachs or top hedge funds, but there’s plenty of good jobs out there for MBAs from these schools, and if you are a CFA charterholder too, all the better.
By the way, I work with a lot of people from Stifel and almost no one has a top 10 MBA.
 
Also factor in where you want to work in these decisions, location wise. If Texas is your choice, UT is prob best bet.
 
It’s sad to think that unless you have a degree from Wharton, Harvard B, etc.. that your MBA can be thought of as worthless.
 
I work at a BB and there are plenty of people with MBA’s from non-top ten B-schools. I don’t think I know of anyone out of the top 25, though. I think the people who say anything outside of top 5 is worthless are just being snobs - unless you HAVE to work at KKR, there are plenty of strong B-schools. However, when you get outside the top 25, I think you’re pushing things if you want to get into banking. You might have trouble coming from Pepperdine, USF, and Loyola, although it’s probably not impossible.
 
“My concern is the worthlessness of any programs below the golden threshold of top 3, 5, or 10.”
After some thought I realized this is a dumb question. 95% of people don’t get into a top 5 or 10 program, many of which work in high-level finance roles. So should everyone who doesn’t go to H/S/W choose not to get an MBA or leave it off their resume? No of course not.
The bottom line is that there are lots of programs that will open many many doors. It’s not all about rankings. If you get admitted to a top 5 or 10 school, great. If you can’t get into a top program, find a reputable school that has a strong alumni presence in the location you hope to work post-MBA…. because in the end, your alumni network can be very helpful in landing a role.
 
UT Austin is one of the only MBA programs that runs its own Mutual Fund. I’m getting my MBA there and I’ve heard the 20 or so people who are involved in that can pretty much go wherever they want. They also have a program for about 10 people with local Venture Capital Firms and they can pretty much do whatever they want in VC. So I think some of these non-top 10 schools offer plenty of opportunities, but its a little more difficult to get where you want to go. I start recruiting in 2 months so I’ll let you know how I do.
 
I believe it’s a myth. Top ranked schools like U of Chic, NYU, Columbia, Cornell, and Harvard have the advantage of a large student body conveniently located in the NE. These “factories” are great places to camp out of two years while waiting for one of the bulge brackets to pick you up. Though many top 50 schools also have high caliber students, location away from NY and a smaller student body plays a disadvantage. However, I’ve seen small schools like Vanderbilt and U of Washington place 15% of their small student bodies into Ibanks scattered among bulge brackets and boutiques. Though they have less of a chance at landing an ibanking gig at Goldman, landing a the same position at JP Morgan, Deutsche Bank, Bank of America, or Wachovia made it worth their while. In short, if you don’t make it to a top 5 school in the NE, it’s certainly not the end of the world.
 
What about SMU or TCU if you’re in Texas? They are both smaller schools with pretty tight alumni networks if I understand correctly and SMU may even be ranked higher than UT.
 
Both are good in their areas. SMU in Dallas and TCU in Ft Worth. I think SMU has a better reach and TCU is pretty much just Ft Worth. However, the networking from those schools is pretty solid. All the money that goes/went to those schools has to come from somewhere…and they have a strong tendancy to take care of their own.
If you want to stay in Dallas SMU is not a bad choice at all. Of course, you still have to get out and network, but their are some opportunities there.
 
> from Pepperdine, USF, and Loyola, although it’s
> probably not impossible.
Isn’t Pepperdine in Malibu, CA? That wouldn’t be a bad place to hang out for a couple of years and I’m sure there would be alot of eye candy walking around!
 
the girls at pepperdine are pretty ridiculously hot. for a business school outside of the top 25, you could certainly do worse than pepperdine
 
Dude, the girls in SocCal are so money. I work in Santa Monica, about a five min walk from the Pacific Ocean.
Being out at lunch never gets old, model chicks in bikinis everywhere. Ugly and fat chicks don’t even bother coming out of the house unless it’s under the cover of darkness….and lots of make-up.
 
jlx177 Wrote:
——————————————————-
> “My concern is the worthlessness of any programs
> below the golden threshold of top 3, 5, or 10.”
>
> After some thought I realized this is a dumb
> question. 95% of people don’t get into a top 5 or
> 10 program, many of which work in high-level
> finance roles. So should everyone who doesn’t go
> to H/S/W choose not to get an MBA or leave it off
> their resume? No of course not.
>
> The bottom line is that there are lots of programs
> that will open many many doors. It’s not all about
> rankings. If you get admitted to a top 5 or 10
> school, great. If you can’t get into a top
> program, find a reputable school that has a strong
> alumni presence in the location you hope to work
> post-MBA…. because in the end, your alumni
> network can be very helpful in landing a role.
First off, this post was an expository thread to spark debate. I asked no questions.
However, assuming I asked the question, it is not dumb just because the answer is intuitive.
Your response was one of the main points of the thread. The concept does not make sense (at least to me) when you think about in terms of variables like geography, alumni connections, personality traits, individual determination etc, yet the belief persists. I hear it all the time on AF forum and elsewhere.
 
I don’t think it’s a myth. I think the discrepancy comes from people’s different perceptions about what constitutes a “good” or “top” job. If you want to work at the very best finance firms, you need to go top 3. I doubt there is a single USC MBA working at Blackstone (just check out the profiles on the website if you don’t believe me). Are there plenty of USC folks who are doing well in other firms? Absolutely. You are not worthless if you go to USC. But you aren’t eligible for a TOP job, either, and you never will be. If you do not get on the “right” track, it is almost impossible to break in. Most of the people who obsess about top 3-5 MBA programs recognize this and want to get on the track so that they can get the best possible jobs available. For their purposes, a USC MBA is worthless. Ultimately, it depends on what you expect to get out of the program.
 
“But you aren’t eligible for a TOP job, either, and you never will be.”
Dumbest thing I’ve ever heard… There are so many holes in this statement I can’t even bring myself to post a retort.
By the way, there are tons of people at Blackstone don’t have an MBA from a top 3 b-school.
 
I know several recruiters at an investment bank and can report that school snobbery is alive and well there. If you didn’t go to a top program, your resume is on the bottom of the pile and you better have something very unique about your background if you want to break in.
 
when I spoke with a recruiter they told me that unless I wanted to just look at corporate finance regionally I should go to a top 20 school.
 
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